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Profile Gary Roberts
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Message 64107 - Posted: 12 Feb 2007, 12:51:17 UTC
Last modified: 12 Feb 2007, 13:11:27 UTC

You would have to have been totally not paying attention to have missed the fact that the servers are having issues at the moment. However if you think about the error messages you are receiving and look at how your own machines are behaving you should be able to work out for yourself a few important details. This might prevent you from taking some rather silly actions or making some rather silly statements in your frustration.

Yes, no doubt everyone is frustrated to some degree but if you think calmly about what is going on you are much less likely to give yourself a heart attack :).

Firstly, you've all seen your own client's messages and the large volume of identical stuff that people insist on posting as well. They all indicate a server problem and not a client problem. In other words there is nothing you can do to your client that is going to change things. So things like detaching, resetting, uninstalling, manually updating ad infinitum, etc are essentially a complete waste of time.

One of the things that perplexes a lot of people is "why do some machines/users seem to be largely unaffected and other machines just can't get action going at all?" I believe the reason for this is linked to whether or not a machine needs new large data file(s) or not. I have many machines that don't need new large data files at the moment and so they are doing just as Pooh Bear has mentioned a couple of times, ie downloading and uploading results without problems. I have other machines that do not get any new work. I believe that this is because they need some form of database lookup to decide a new large data file and that something of this nature is failing and so - no more work.

Secondly, many people are complaining that they can't upload results. If you are worried about this, here is what I have worked out with a little bit of experimenting. On the basis that the problems are connected in some way with downloading new large data files, I decided to break the connection between downloading and uploading so that they are not both being attempted (and both failing) at the same time. All I did was set "No new tasks" on an affected machine, and then "update" the EAH project on that machine. BOINC then tries the upload only without the request for new work. This seems to succeed in about 100% of the cases. After clearing the stuck uploads, I simply re-enable work requests. I still don't get work but at least dozens of uploads are successfully reported, with quite a few examples of "ALREADY Reported" messages too :).

Thirdly, a few people are complaining quite vocally about a lack of information. Statements about "just a line or two" being needed, or "the developers need to wake up" or "worst project for communication" or "the servers must be hacked" or "server status all green - what rubbish", etc, tend to fly about from time to time. Here are my thoughts on this.

If "Just a line or two would suffice" then simply read what the server tells you each time a transaction fails. The messages are actually quite informative if you think about them. Oh, I see, you really meant a page or three giving much fuller "blow by blow" descriptions of what is happening all the time. I would have thought it would be pretty obvious that this problem, whatever it is, is quite intractible and until all the facets of it have been fully investigated it's just about impossible to give you a deep and meaningful report without wasting a lot more time and perhaps indulging in speculation about possible scenarios which ultimately turn out to be wrong anyway. If you start trying to give short "update" reports, you can bet your bottom dollar that someone will start wingeing for the next one shortly after the previous one was given. The staff resource to manage this rather nasty ongoing situation is quite small and should be left alone to get the job done.

Much has been commented about the server status page. Here are my thoughts on this. Green means that the hardware is powered and that at least one process of the type indicated is running. Take validation for example. There are two different types of results (S5RI and the old S5R1) so two different programs are needed. Depending on how many results are being returned, multiple instances of the validator program may be needed to handle the load. Of course, each extra instance of the validator program chews up more RAM and more cycles and increases server load. I would think it would be quite feasible in an overstressed server environment, to temporarily shut down the bulk of the running validators to give cycles to other more needy parts of the system. If there is just one validator instance still running (but unable to keep up) the status will still be green but you will see a growing backlog of results to be validated. So what!!! You have to at least give the Devs some credit for trying to juggle things for the better performance of the system as a whole.

As a final comment to some people, please don't keep starting new threads with essentially the same complaint in perhaps a slightly different guise. We all know you are frustrated and we all support your right to express that frustration. But please not in umpteen different threads with pretty much the same winge over and over again. That creates its own level of frustration in others.


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Message 64111 - Posted: 12 Feb 2007, 13:23:33 UTC

Well said. This deserves to be stickied, or even given FAQ status.

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Message 64157 - Posted: 13 Feb 2007, 4:38:29 UTC

Cool, timely, and objective. Wow, and witty too. Thanks, Gary, reading your comments felt good. :)
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Message 64251 - Posted: 14 Feb 2007, 22:29:41 UTC

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Message 64280 - Posted: 15 Feb 2007, 6:24:29 UTC

Thanks for the post Gary, just wish this thread would get stickied (stickyed?) so that the non-informative threads don't keep sending this one lower.

In the few years I have been BOINCing (>7 if you could the pre-BOINC version of SETI@Home), I have consistently found Einstein@Home to be the most stable of the projects I have crunched. I continue to crunch for this project as I support its goals, and I have another 2 projects that can take over any "spare" cycles if I don't manage to get WUs from here.

Thanks to the moderators for posting and keeping us informed, thanks to the project team for working hard in the background, and thanks to ALL you Einstein users who quietly continue to crunch this project without making any threats to leave, etc. I believe the quiet users are the majority :) but the squeaky wheels are the ones that get the attention.

<hugs> to everyone and the camomile tea is on me!

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Message 64304 - Posted: 15 Feb 2007, 21:12:26 UTC - in response to Message 64107.

Geez-gosh-whizz ... If you had bothered to post the info that you sent to the message board, that would have helped 100%! At least we would understand what is going on...


Thirdly, a few people are complaining quite vocally about a lack of information. Statements about "just a line or two" being needed, or "the developers need to wake up" or "worst project for communication" or "the servers must be hacked" or "server status all green - what rubbish", etc, tend to fly about from time to time. Here are my thoughts on this.

If "Just a line or two would suffice" then simply read what the server tells you each time a transaction fails. The messages are actually quite informative if you think about them. Oh, I see, you really meant a page or three giving much fuller "blow by blow" descriptions of what is happening all the time. I would have thought it would be pretty obvious that this problem, whatever it is, is quite intractible and until all the facets of it have been fully investigated it's just about impossible to give you a deep and meaningful report without wasting a lot more time and perhaps indulging in speculation about possible scenarios which ultimately turn out to be wrong anyway. If you start trying to give short "update" reports, you can bet your bottom dollar that someone will start wingeing for the next one shortly after the previous one was given. The staff resource to manage this rather nasty ongoing situation is quite small and should be left alone to get the job done.

Much has been commented about the server status page. Here are my thoughts on this. Green means that the hardware is powered and that at least one process of the type indicated is running. Take validation for example. There are two different types of results (S5RI and the old S5R1) so two different programs are needed. Depending on how many results are being returned, multiple instances of the validator program may be needed to handle the load. Of course, each extra instance of the validator program chews up more RAM and more cycles and increases server load. I would think it would be quite feasible in an overstressed server environment, to temporarily shut down the bulk of the running validators to give cycles to other more needy parts of the system. If there is just one validator instance still running (but unable to keep up) the status will still be green but you will see a growing backlog of results to be validated. So what!!! You have to at least give the Devs some credit for trying to juggle things for the better performance of the system as a whole.

As a final comment to some people, please don't keep starting new threads with essentially the same complaint in perhaps a slightly different guise. We all know you are frustrated and we all support your right to express that frustration. But please not in umpteen different threads with pretty much the same winge over and over again. That creates its own level of frustration in others.

[/quote]

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Message 64305 - Posted: 15 Feb 2007, 22:39:41 UTC - in response to Message 64107.

Thirdly, a few people are complaining quite vocally about a lack of information. Statements about "just a line or two" being needed, or "the developers need to wake up" or "worst project for communication" or "the servers must be hacked" or "server status all green - what rubbish", etc, tend to fly about from time to time. Here are my thoughts on this.


From the outset, let me say that having read this post, I am quite happy to sit and wait for a solution to be found and implemented.

Like everyone else, I'm experiencing problems with some of my computers. And, obviously unlike some of the posters, I have worked in a high-pressure support environment where you learn _very_ quickly to ignore telephone calls & etc while you are working to fix the problem.

But (don't ya just hate that word?) a prominent "line or two" (on the EAH home page perhaps) informs us, the user base, that the support team are aware of the problem. If everyone sat idly by and did not say anything, then it is possible, just possible, that the EAH team would not know that a problem exists.

Paying heed to the error messages and keeping quiet about them does not expedite a solution. Neither does starting numerous threads on the same issue. And polemic rhetoric should be left to the politicans and such others with no gainful employment. All we need is the application of that most rare of commodities - common sense!

Just my 2c worth.

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Message 64335 - Posted: 16 Feb 2007, 12:21:23 UTC
Last modified: 16 Feb 2007, 12:23:28 UTC

I would like to thank all those who have expressed appreciation for the information that I have tried provide in this thread. It is frustrating for all of us to experience the difficulties in getting regular work and reporting the results. My reason for posting is to try to ease the level of frustration and not to try to pretend that the problems don't exist or to suggest that they should simply be ignored.

As I read through the responses, there are a couple of comments that need to be addressed. One of those is that I should sticky this post. OK, that has now been done. Another is that I should post a summary on the front page. Unfortunately that is something I can't do as I'm not a staff member of the project. I'm simply a user like everyone else, with the ability to do some basic housekeeping, like deleting posts or threads or making a thread sticky.

Many people wonder why the project staff seem to be insensitive to the user frustration. Believe me, I'm sure they are not. I'm sure it's just a matter of too many fires to fight and too few firefighters to do it. Take a look at the contributors page and see if you can find any IT specialists who might be responsible for the management of the server farm and the ongoing development of the software system that runs that farm. How many database specialists are there who know all the tricks to really improve database performance? Unfortunately it is the physicists themselves that have to do this. Any programmers you see there are working on the science apps and not the server back end or database code.

The problems are certainly with the server and database code as this thread over at Seti seems to indicate. In a later message, Matt Lebofsky indicates that both Seti and Einstein are being affected. I'm sure people like Bruce Allen and David Hammer are doing their best to resolve these problems as quickly as possible.

The problems will ultimately be solved. Indications are there that this may well be sooner rather than later now that those over at Seti seem to have worked out a possible strategy. I'm sure the project staff will let us know more details as soon as they are able to. In the meantime, I would like to thank you for your continuing support and patience.


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Message 64383 - Posted: 17 Feb 2007, 19:34:03 UTC

Gary, I appreciate your efforts. I do believe there are multiple problems confronting the admin folks here and can appreciate that they are up to their elbows in alligators. Still, it really would be nice to have seen some home page update in the past month given the ongoing very real problems encountered here. It has been a rather lousy two months here.

Like others, I am a strong advocate of running multiple projects -- I have no systems with less than two projects and nearly all of my own collection have three or four active projects.

With the ongoing problems here, I was going to suspend processing on Einstein pending resolution -- and probably a resolution which is confirmed by 10 days to two weeks solid running. What I've done first though, is set Einstein to 'no new work'. That way I'll be able to clear my Einstein work to do within the next week or less. As each workstation clears the last Einstein workunit, I set it to suspend Einstein,

I think it is a reasonable approach for the duration as there are multiple worthy BOINC projects which currently are running fairly well (including SETI, even with its much larger database). Then again, it means that posting a home page announcement is a bit more important for me, as I'm rather disinclined to tramp thru multiple message boards and threads here to glean status information.


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Message 64424 - Posted: 18 Feb 2007, 15:17:56 UTC - in response to Message 64383.

Gary, I appreciate your efforts. I do believe there are multiple problems confronting the admin folks here and can appreciate that they are up to their elbows in alligators. Still, it really would be nice to have seen some home page update in the past month given the ongoing very real problems encountered here. It has been a rather lousy two months here.

Like others, I am a strong advocate of running multiple projects -- I have no systems with less than two projects and nearly all of my own collection have three or four active projects.

With the ongoing problems here, I was going to suspend processing on Einstein pending resolution -- and probably a resolution which is confirmed by 10 days to two weeks solid running. What I've done first though, is set Einstein to 'no new work'. That way I'll be able to clear my Einstein work to do within the next week or less. As each workstation clears the last Einstein workunit, I set it to suspend Einstein,

I think it is a reasonable approach for the duration as there are multiple worthy BOINC projects which currently are running fairly well (including SETI, even with its much larger database). Then again, it means that posting a home page announcement is a bit more important for me, as I'm rather disinclined to tramp thru multiple message boards and threads here to glean status information.



Just a simply explaination is all I have been asking for during the past 3 weeks and all I got was flamed, and would like to apologise for my petty response.

I would assume that since my uploaded and reported credits are showing up in the "credits pending" as well as "results", I will get credit eventually, but like yourself, I just can't figure out why they can't write a couple of sentences explaining things on the status page. It kind of makes one wonder if the problem is one of a serious nature, but again an explaination that the project is going to continue would be enough for me to remain.

It appears I have been getting credit for some of the pending jobs as my overall point total is slowly rising. However the results pending number is rising much faster. As long as the thing still seems to be working I'm going to stay put. I am running Rosetta on a couple of machines, but being on dialup I'm spending more time downloading than anything else.:-( If you know of a worthwhile program that's up and running smoothly let me know. :-)

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Message 64436 - Posted: 18 Feb 2007, 18:06:33 UTC - in response to Message 64424.

If you know of a worthwhile program that's up and running smoothly let me know. :-)

F. Prefect

I suggest you to try QMC@home. The new WUs are heavy and the quorum is 1.
Tullio
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Message 64442 - Posted: 18 Feb 2007, 18:45:50 UTC - in response to Message 64424.

Correct, the database has been in 'dribble validation mode' for the past week or so (in addition to other problems that have occurred and been dealt with or remain ongoing).

Regarding other projects that run pretty smoothly, the two I added in the past year or so are World Grid (which has a bit different interface but is part of the BOINC group) and Rosetta -- I pushed computer cycles over to Rosetta with the beginning of Einstein's severe problems in December. Those two projects now are getting about 60% of my cycles over the past two months. SETI has also been a benefactor of the shift from Einstein -- back in November (when Einstein was still running reliably), SETI was getting less than 15% of my CPU time, now it gets 25%. SETI runs reasonably reliably (they have a weekly 3 to 4 hour outage on Tuesdays which is planned), and further, the much larger and proactive user community there means that when there are problems, the word gets out big time.




It appears I have been getting credit for some of the pending jobs as my overall point total is slowly rising. However the results pending number is rising much faster. As long as the thing still seems to be working I'm going to stay put. I am running Rosetta on a couple of machines, but being on dialup I'm spending more time downloading than anything else.:-( If you know of a worthwhile program that's up and running smoothly let me know. :-)

F. Prefect


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Message 64454 - Posted: 18 Feb 2007, 22:32:09 UTC - in response to Message 64335.

I would like to thank all those who have expressed appreciation for the information that I have tried provide in this thread. It is frustrating for all of us to experience the difficulties in getting regular work and reporting the results. My reason for posting is to try to ease the level of frustration and not to try to pretend that the problems don't exist or to suggest that they should simply be ignored.

.....

The problems will ultimately be solved. Indications are there that this may well be sooner rather than later now that those over at Seti seem to have worked out a possible strategy. I'm sure the project staff will let us know more details as soon as they are able to. In the meantime, I would like to thank you for your continuing support and patience.



Thanks for your efforts and the valuable information, Gary.

I'll keep cooking for E@H, with a duty cycle of 12.5% down from 100%. And have elected climateprediction.net as my 'other' project - no worries with this one, the expected execution time is over 2000 hours per WU, you download one WU and forget about it ... Once I have chewed about 10 of those, I'll have learnt to be patient and will reconsider E@H ;)

It's a pity that no official information has been forthcoming from the project. Someone wrote in a post that E@H never promised a problem-free ride. Granted. But if the broad user support E@H have gained just evaporates, nothing will be gained.

Kind regards, and thanks again.

-rg-


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Message 64458 - Posted: 18 Feb 2007, 23:39:01 UTC

I could understand if this problem had only been happening for a few day, but IIRC it's been ongoing for almost two weeks. That, and the fact their is no "official" response on the main E@H page, shows a real lack of respect toward contributors.

I quite E@H once before, looks like it's time to do so again. Sad really.
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Message 64464 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007, 1:23:45 UTC - in response to Message 64335.

I would like to thank all those who have expressed appreciation for the information that I have tried provide in this thread. It is frustrating for all of us to experience the difficulties in getting regular work and reporting the results. My reason for posting is to try to ease the level of frustration and not to try to pretend that the problems don't exist or to suggest that they should simply be ignored.

As I read through the responses, there are a couple of comments that need to be addressed. One of those is that I should sticky this post. OK, that has now been done. Another is that I should post a summary on the front page. Unfortunately that is something I can't do as I'm not a staff member of the project. I'm simply a user like everyone else, with the ability to do some basic housekeeping, like deleting posts or threads or making a thread sticky.

Many people wonder why the project staff seem to be insensitive to the user frustration. Believe me, I'm sure they are not. I'm sure it's just a matter of too many fires to fight and too few firefighters to do it. Take a look at the contributors page and see if you can find any IT specialists who might be responsible for the management of the server farm and the ongoing development of the software system that runs that farm. How many database specialists are there who know all the tricks to really improve database performance? Unfortunately it is the physicists themselves that have to do this. Any programmers you see there are working on the science apps and not the server back end or database code.

The problems are certainly with the server and database code as this thread over at Seti seems to indicate. In a later message, Matt Lebofsky indicates that both Seti and Einstein are being affected. I'm sure people like Bruce Allen and David Hammer are doing their best to resolve these problems as quickly as possible.

The problems will ultimately be solved. Indications are there that this may well be sooner rather than later now that those over at Seti seem to have worked out a possible strategy. I'm sure the project staff will let us know more details as soon as they are able to. In the meantime, I would like to thank you for your continuing support and patience.



Excellent post. Personally I believe that if there are still plans for the project to remain in existance over a significant period of time, they are making a very big mistake by not informing the current contributors regarding the current as well as future status of the project.

The only possible reason I can imagine for their lack of action is the fear of losing particpants, which of course, in most cases will never return after setting up shop elsewhere. I hope I'm wrong, and am continuing to run Einstein@home on all machine and will continue to do so as long as the results are being shown to have been received and the my total credit number continues to increase albeit at a very slow rate, and all sent jobs are showing up on the results page and my pending credit continues to increase.

However after reading several of the posts in this forum and others, I would tend to believe they are losing more participants than if they simply post a short message giving the current and future status of the project and at least many who have been with the program for a lengthy period of time as well as others considering joining or have only been with the program for a short period of time, can now make an informed decision as to what they intend to do.

Their apparent position that "the truth will kill", are very likely to discover that the total lack of action will get the job done just as quickly while at the same time showing total disrespect to those who have several years invested in the project.
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Message 64465 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007, 1:36:12 UTC
Last modified: 19 Feb 2007, 1:57:56 UTC

Well spoken Gary!
Some of my thoughts after more than a year of E@H involvement:

- E@H is a victim of it's own success. For a number of reasons, and ironically reliability is prominent amongst them, it has steadily grown ie.



for those of you cognisant with IT stuff and database design in particular, it is often the case that some things just don't scale well. This came to light for E@H late last year with increasing activity of the project declared a number of hardware issues patent.

- we are all actually getting feedback, but many do not realise it, as part of the design of the project: it's called the BOINC error messages. While not absolutely personalised enough for some, they do accurately reflect their computer's situation. If some people are meaning "lack of feedback" == "the project's internal decision loop is not visible to me", then you are absolutely right. By definition really. I would respectfully suggest that it is correct for it to be that way - I won't repeat the many reasons already mentioned for this. Sadly some will take personal offence at this scenario, or at least appear to.. :-)

- it is always worth mentioning, again, the multi-project aspect of BOINC. This is not to say "go away if you're not happy" ( although you may ), but simply reflects that the design of BOINC explicity caters for this. Again no personal impugnment ought be deduced from this.

- there is a fascinating social aspect to this distributed processing paradigm. It certainly confirms the old adage "you can't please everybody". Fundamentally there is a frequent contributor expectation that the provision of volunteered resources necessarily implies a quid pro quo of some sort. I guess it does, however some look to beyond a mere "thanks for your time", aka credits. I really don't know where to go from there along that line of thinking, except to point out that credits don't actually mean anything outside the confines of this "castle in the air" that is the E@H project. It really is a pretty pure knowledge project/experiment and about as cutting edge as it gets ( that is: no-one has yet detected a gravity wave, and boy will it make a splash when it does! ) My view is that if one doesn't get a tingle up the spine simply by being involved in this historic enterprise then I probably am actually on another intellectual plane! I mean that sincerely and kindly without malice or being condescending !! :-)

- as for the project staff, they are superb in my view. They no doubt they wince when reading some posts ( mine included ) but they have remained professional and hardworking. Please don't be too harsh if you conclude their apparent absence as some variey of snub. Also please don't assume that there is some open ended resource bucket yet to be dipped into either. Instead consider it a blessing if the ship's engineer spends his time in the engine-room rather than chatting with the passengers on deck, and more so if the seas are rough!

Having vented the bilge on that ( metaphors are not my strong point ), let's all ease up a bit and be patient. :-)

Cheers, Mike.

NB. I wonder how many know that Bruce Allen was a graduate student of Stephen Hawking? To grossly understate - that is not a position casually obtained! That does not make him some god that strides upon the Earth, but likewise he is no flunky functionary that some contributors have implied. There really is no known reason to concoct personal attacks - you know who you are - and I will vigourously delete such board activity at any such time it arises, then as now. :-)

( edit ) '...open ended resource bucket...' - groan! What was I thinking! :-)
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Message 64491 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007, 13:42:46 UTC - in response to Message 64465.

Well spoken Gary!
Some of my thoughts after more than a year of E@H involvement:

- E@H is a victim of it's own success. For a number of reasons, and ironically reliability is prominent amongst them, it has steadily grown ie.

((image : see previous post))

for those of you cognisant with IT stuff and database design in particular, it is often the case that some things just don't scale well. This came to light for E@H late last year with increasing activity of the project declared a number of hardware issues patent.

- we are all actually getting feedback, but many do not realise it, as part of the design of the project: it's called the BOINC error messages. While not absolutely personalised enough for some, they do accurately reflect their computer's situation. If some people are meaning "lack of feedback" == "the project's internal decision loop is not visible to me", then you are absolutely right. By definition really. I would respectfully suggest that it is correct for it to be that way - I won't repeat the many reasons already mentioned for this. Sadly some will take personal offence at this scenario, or at least appear to.. :-)

- it is always worth mentioning, again, the multi-project aspect of BOINC. This is not to say "go away if you're not happy" ( although you may ), but simply reflects that the design of BOINC explicity caters for this. Again no personal impugnment ought be deduced from this.

- there is a fascinating social aspect to this distributed processing paradigm. It certainly confirms the old adage "you can't please everybody". Fundamentally there is a frequent contributor expectation that the provision of volunteered resources necessarily implies a quid pro quo of some sort. I guess it does, however some look to beyond a mere "thanks for your time", aka credits. I really don't know where to go from there along that line of thinking, except to point out that credits don't actually mean anything outside the confines of this "castle in the air" that is the E@H project. It really is a pretty pure knowledge project/experiment and about as cutting edge as it gets ( that is: no-one has yet detected a gravity wave, and boy will it make a splash when it does! ) My view is that if one doesn't get a tingle up the spine simply by being involved in this historic enterprise then I probably am actually on another intellectual plane! I mean that sincerely and kindly without malice or being condescending !! :-)

- as for the project staff, they are superb in my view. They no doubt they wince when reading some posts ( mine included ) but they have remained professional and hardworking. Please don't be too harsh if you conclude their apparent absence as some variey of snub. Also please don't assume that there is some open ended resource bucket yet to be dipped into either. Instead consider it a blessing if the ship's engineer spends his time in the engine-room rather than chatting with the passengers on deck, and more so if the seas are rough!

Having vented the bilge on that ( metaphors are not my strong point ), let's all ease up a bit and be patient. :-)

Cheers, Mike.

NB. I wonder how many know that Bruce Allen was a graduate student of Stephen Hawking? To grossly understate - that is not a position casually obtained! That does not make him some god that strides upon the Earth, but likewise he is no flunky functionary that some contributors have implied. There really is no known reason to concoct personal attacks - you know who you are - and I will vigourously delete such board activity at any such time it arises, then as now. :-)

( edit ) '...open ended resource bucket...' - groan! What was I thinking! :-)


Thanks Mike !

There is indeed a social aspect to this argument. It's all about partnership and expected fairness, as I understand it.

The contributors community controls a valuable resource, which it allocates to various degrees to E@H's computing needs. The community does so for the love of a good science project, or to garner credits, or for whatever particular reasons a member may have. By the mere fact that the project needs and accepts to use this freely contributed resource, it enters a partnership with the community.

We all rely for our social interactions on some sense of fairness, as do some of our relatives on the path of evolution. This sense of fairness has helped resolve or prevent frustrations on several occasions :
1.
the credit allocation scheme was revised after long-standing protests of the Linux contributors base claiming that the allocation based on the BOINC benchmarks was arbitrary and unfair.
2.
feedback and valuable technical information on the project's progress was eventually posted on the Science board.
3.
within hours of the hardware outages hitting the E@H's file server, the IT staff had an HTTP server up with a short and informative message on display. Which the community greatly appreciated.

Now, if there is growing dissatisfaction within the contributors community with the PR or problem management aspects of the project, I guess they can a) educate the community to proper attitudes and expectations, or b) adjust their model of said community to fit the experimental data. As you say, a fascinating and unexpected aspect of this project.

What I see so far is the community helping itself - many thanks again to the moderators. The silence on the project's side sounds like
we don't have a problem, regrettably we don't even know how to fix it, and it's none of your business anyway.

Now, I was just trolling - but a few lines would have prevented a lot a grief.

Regards.

-rg-
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Profile kami4ligo
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Message 64507 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007, 19:49:35 UTC - in response to Message 64491.
Last modified: 19 Feb 2007, 19:52:12 UTC

Great !

After all these days of anguish in the community, Bernd Maschenschalk has posted a short message about the current problems.

So, the project did not fall inside the event horizont yet ! We keep hoping ;)

-rg-
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Sherwood
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Message 64510 - Posted: 19 Feb 2007, 23:16:24 UTC

Hello All,

I spend 40 minutes reading all the threads about the past two weeks issues.

In these days of trouble, I am having a hard time to keep all my machines buzy crunching for EAH (being in the top 30 RAC I do have a few machines to take care of...) and it would really help if somebody could confirm that it is 100% sure that no credit will be lost in the recovery process. May be I overlooked some threads but frankly this information deserves a well placed message.

One remark.

I am not a usual participant to these forums. I believe a lot of people like me would not have needed to spend 40 minutes trying to find out what is going wrong if at least a small message would be posted on the home page of EAH. We all know systems admins are buzy trying to fix the problem but the variety of participants (IT savvys and the other) deserve various commmunications channels I believe.

Sherwood

Odysseus
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Message 64511 - Posted: 20 Feb 2007, 0:09:14 UTC - in response to Message 64510.

In these days of trouble, I am having a hard time to keep all my machines buzy crunching for EAH (being in the top 30 RAC I do have a few machines to take care of...) and it would really help if somebody could confirm that it is 100% sure that no credit will be lost in the recovery process.

I doubt anything can be stated with 100% certainty in this business … but AFAICT it would take a new and unforeseen (and probably quite spectacular, or at least multiple) failure of some kind for results that are already ‘safely pending’ in the database to get lost.
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This material is based upon work supported by the National Science Foundation (NSF) under Grants PHY-1104902, PHY-1104617 and PHY-1105572 and by the Max Planck Gesellschaft (MPG). Any opinions, findings, and conclusions or recommendations expressed in this material are those of the investigators and do not necessarily reflect the views of the NSF or the MPG.

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